Feeling the burn over back-yard fires (Article)

Feeling the burn over back-yard fires (Article)

As more people enjoy sitting around the back-yard fire pit, some neighbors are up in arms over the health risks from the smoke. (excerpt)

By TOM MEERSMAN
Star Tribune-Minneapolis-St. Paul, Minnesota
October 12, 2008

Below are some comments from the StarTribune.com blog on the above story...

Did you all miss the health hazard and toxic chemicals?
Maybe I should just hold you all down and stuff a cigarette in your mouth if you like it so much. We live next to "burners", and have family members with asthma, and it's a real problem. There is a reason smoking is banned, this will hopefully follow suit. It is not a "mind your own business" deal when what they do directly affects others. If it was a construction site spewing dust particulates everywhere, you would all be against it.
posted by bluebird74

What in the world are you thinking?
Campfires are irritants when you are camping. Remember the challenge of getting out of the way the smoke is blowing? If you or your child has asthma, you simply cannot have campfires, even when camping. The toxins released are worse than standing behind the diesel bus. If you think that people don't burn illegal brush etc just because someone at their house picked up a free permit once, you are naive. If you choose to have a campfire when you are out away from civilization and everyone breathing the smoke and pollutants is a part of your group, you have my blessing. However, I do not agree with my neighbors having the right to make my yard uninhabitable every weekend all summer and fall. Houses are so close and wind will do what it will, but I could sit on their decks and not get the smoke because it is blowing from both of their fires to my deck, away from their houses. No, we live too close in the suburbs for this to continue.
posted by georgina17

My son has asthma and because I live between three neighbors who, by the way, moved in two years after me, love their fires--day and night. We've been to the hospital several times this past spring and summer with each visit costing $50 plus the additional cost for his medicine, of which we did not use as frequently until they moved in. My neighbors have been told in a very kind manner that my son has asthma, but that has not been a consideration for them--they just keep burning and my son keeps suffering. How nice, NOT! Regulations come in when people start to show no considerations for others which cancels out the "MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS" statement. Just be considerate. Burn less often so we all can enjoy the outdoors!
posted by AdrienneBTW

These fires are just like 2nd hand smoke
They are awful. They stink. It's just a moron or two per neighborhood that keep having these fires. This is a city, not a campground. Our houses are too close together. I hope they ban the fires.
posted by dgb04

Warm your backyard and the globe
Improving air quality is an on-going and uphill battle, and Campfires are a significant source of air pollution in Minneapolis that is totally avoidable. In fact, a campfire produces signifcantly more greenhouse gases than a car. Benzene, C02 and other harmful pollutants are all produced by outdoor recreational fires. According to some studies, a wood fire can emit as many fine particles into the air in nine hours as does a a mid-size automobile traveling 11,000 mile in one year. (http://www.eauquebec.com/air/chauf-bois/index-en.htm) Many progressive cities such as Seattle have limited or banned outdoor fires during poor air quality periods, and sometimes banned them altogether. With air quality concerns in Minneapolis, it seems like an issue the city should be taking seriously. posted by styopr

Rednecks wanting their "rights."
What part of asthma isn't serious to those of you touting the constitution? It is a real medical problem, as are other respiratory diseases. Should we all still be able to smoke in the break room at work or maybe on a plane? C'mon, those in the vicinity of the toxic smoke should just "get over it." Burn all the smoke you want in your own house, but when it is making mine stink, you've invaded MY rights. posted by bluebird74

I just got back from Beijing where everybody burns everything, and even in the country the air looks like a forest fire is in progress. Yes, smoke is bad for you.
posted by betty6114

No place for campfires in the city.
Campfires belong at campgrounds not in your densely populated neighborhood in the city...
posted by phishe

Your Rights End Where Mine Begin!
No one has a right to case hardship and harm to others, especially if it is for something as trivial as their personal amusement. Ban the backyard fires, fireplaces, and the charcoal grills too! It is time to bring Minnesota out of the stone age.
posted by RogK

Not a problem until very recently...
I wonder if this was not a problem in the past because the medical profession failed to recognize asthma and its causes -- so asthmatic children and adults simply died and no one understood that the smoke and pollutants killed them off.

Now we know and understand the condition, and have the means to minimize or even prevent the situations that would harm these people -- this knowledge and understanding also forces upon us the responsibility to not harm our neighbors. As much as we may enjoy a fire, if it produces pollutants that harm our neighbors, it is our responsibility to move the fire to where our neighbors won't be harmed -- like large open parks, out in the country, or a campground away from civilization.
posted by Zarepheth

Outdoor wood boiler
We have a neighbor who can burn 3-5 cords of wood in a densely populated neighborhood. The stink fills the surrounding three homes and bothers maybe another 8-10 homes. This system supplies heat for his home and heats hot water..it used to heat his outdoor pool till city ordinance won't allow him to burn during the summer. He can burn Oct1 thru April. The smoke is rancid, smells like an outdoor fire that is smoldering or has just had water thrown on it to extinguish it. We had healthy, clean air before this boiler system was fired up...I'd like comments to maybe get the city council to regulate it more or only allow them in the country or where the owner has a certain amount of acreage or distances from neighbors. He has one neighbor who's house is within 100 feet of the smoke stack.
posted by bploushine

More..outdoor boiler
I didn't mention that the boiler burned for 180 consecutive days..24 hours a day. We live in suburb 30 miles from St Paul. The smoke is heavy, rancid and loaded with particulate. Why should I have to close my windows and not let my furnace pull in outside air...so he can heat his house and hot water.
posted by bploushine

NO FIRE PITS!!!
I hate the smell of a campfire in a city. It's inconsiderate air pollution. If you want to do it, you should have to get a permit or your should just go camping. Those people siting up several square blocks just so they can have a couple brews around a fire. And no, it's nothing like a fire in your fireplace. Chimneys ensure the smoke goes up and fireplaces are only used in the winter months when everyone has their windows shut.
posted by cartoonconn

Idiots!
The problem is not the increase in regulation... its the decrease (or total loss) of respect for others and accepting responsibility for your actions. A fire pit or outdoor wood boiler in a densely populated area is a problem because the smoke doesn't have space or air movement to adequately diffuse to levels that aren't a nuisance (or health risk, in some cases) to neighbors. Some posters are correct in that burning dry material under ideal conditions will provide a lower-particulate flue, which is less likely to bother neighbors, but still you need the air movement and room for diffusion. I'm so mad right now, I could spit!
posted by Juggernaut

We all have a right to comfortable living
Unless you suffer from asthma, you will never understand how dangerous it is to be breathing this smoke. I had a friend's parent die from asthma in her sleep, how would all you "fun" people feel about that consequence? If you want a campfire, go camping where people expect to smell them. And, as far as other sources being more of an environmental hazard, I cannot believe I'm hearing that in this day and time. We ALL need to do whatever we can to alleviate pollutants in our air - every step is a step in the right direction. Don't be selfish, be responsible.
posted by pruitttm

For the last 5 years I have called the Pollution Control Department of Minn., the police, the fire department, my Champlin City Councilman,and the Mayor.One of our neighbors were burning wet leaves. The other neighbors burn trash. One night, they were burning caustic materials. Our eyes were burning and my husband had to put on a mask. He was working in the garage. This same neighbor was burning something that was so strong, I had to go inside. I was planting flowers in my garden. I do have to close windows so my entire house does not reek. All of these Public Servants, told me that the neighbors were not breaking laws and there was NOT ANYTHING that they could do. But I told them they were burning illegal items. We have asked and asked them to quit burning. They start the fires in their pit and leave. I have called about unattended fires, but no one seems to care. When I enter into Champliin from another city, you can actually see the clouds of dirty smoke, and the smell is overpowering. I don't think We should have to breath in this terrible pollution. We have a right to breath clean air. However no one seems to take this seriously. I'm not a complainer, but when our health is in danger, I feel I have to try to stop this pollution
posted by KathyPeyer

City Officials Should Ban Backyard Burners
If I'm not mistaken, there has been a law against burning trash in the metro area for decades and these backyard firepit/burners seem to be a loophole on this law. It would be a good issue for the city councils of all metro areas to put on their agendas.
posted by Minnepeach19


Great if it didn't affect anyone else!
Unfortunately, burning is an activity that when engaged in by one neighbor may infringe on others. My mother has allergies and was sick with a severe headache for three days when a neighbor had a bonfire. Unfortunately, there is no way to keep the smoke just in the yard of those partaking. So, as much as people here want to make it about individual rights, it isn't about that. You can do whatever you choose in your own house/yard but when that activity affects others who are minding their own business in their own homes, you need to consider them. It's about being considerate to others! Something we need a little more of these days!
posted by karikd

My neighbors don't have any sense
I have asthma and my neighbor's fires do make me ill, especially because he burns garbage, yard waste, plastic, wet wood, etc. I keep my windows closed all summer but it still seeps in since the air conditioner has to take in air. When asked to stop or at least stop burning after midnight he tells me to call the police (which I will the next time). It's hard for nice people to understand that many peoples' neighbors are not nice and don't have sense.
posted by cloyd42

oops Hello all: To the firepit burners who are telling the recipients of their smoke pollution to "go inside and close their windows" A house is not hermetically sealed. There is always a certain amount of air leakage around even tightly-closed doors and windows. Within that air leakage are ultrafine particles (PM2.5) as well as significant amounts of carbon monoxide, from combustion. Indoor air pollution is a function of outdoor air pollution. When particulate levels rise outside, they rise inside too, to the extent that there can be up to 70% of the pollution indoors as there is outdoors.
posted by cleanair

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